2006/02/13
Mini w/ dual monitors part deux
Edit: A couple people have reported problems using the dualhead2go with different types of monitors. I'm looking further into the problem. Check the comments for more details.
After being dugg on our article about the dual head mac mini, there were several good questions pointed out on various sites. Most of these centered around things like DVI support, crap on my desk, software I am running, and the capabilities of the system under such a load. This post is aimed at answering those questions.
1) From zwitl at digg.com:
These are valid points. The reason we bought this particular mac, and not one that might have more upgradability is simple: 1st, Scott and I just went full time with Firefall Pro 5 months ago. As part of our startup cost, we had to purchase enough computer equipment for four full time employees, plus a server. We picked up the minis at $500 a piece, plus gigantor 22" CRT's for a combined cost of around $800 per computer. Throw in extraneous software and peripherals and the price came to a level $900. This is $400 less than the cheapest current iMac, which would have been a 17" monitor, and thus a drastic reduction in resolution.
Now no one is saying that we had the expectation of being able to upgrade the minis from the factory. At most, we intended to double the RAM, and maybe, just maybe, upgrade to a faster/larger HDD, be it through firewire or a replacement of the internal. And no one is saying that this particular solution to the dual screen output is completely ideal. But I will say this: it works, reliably and well. A cost comparison between this solution and using an iMac with two monitors comes out to $1170 vs. $1550, maintaining a significant margin.
With regard to the comment about the imac with a second monitor being "a so easy and clean," I personally feel that it is much less strain on the eyes to have two monitors which are exactly the same, vs. an Imac and a second totally disparate monitor, since Apple produces nothing in terms of standalone monitors that really matches it. And upgrading to an iMack also solves none of the lack of an upgrade path problem. To solve that, you need to move up to a G5 tower, which, as you may have guessed, costs a fair amount more.
2)
Indeed it would. However, there is nothing on the market which provides this type of split capability via DVI. perhaps in a year or two, there will be, and that will completely nullify this solution.
3)
You could certainly say that, although I would say it's just right. I have two Westinghouse 17" LCD's, an Apple Extended ADB keyboard, a Microsoft optical mouse, a pair of headphones, and a mini. Also pictured is an ipod 5G. This set up was completely iterative. Originally it was simply a mini and a Phillips 22" CRT running at a breathtaking (and blinding) 1920x1440. We had also originally purchased sets of MS keyboards and mice, as they were cheap, and completely functional. The first swap was the ADB keyboard for the MS keyboard, since, as Scott said, I like "clicky" keyboards. They remind me of the Sun 386i I was weaned on. Then came the monitor upgrade. The reason I used Westinghouse as opposed to a prettier brand was because I had one sitting in a closet at home, and I like it when things match. the LCD quality on them is completely acceptable to me, as is the price / resolution, at $200 for 1280x1024. This of course, doesn't mean you couldn't use a more classical mac mix of hardware. This is what makes me happy.
4)
Yeah, it does seem to groan more often set up like this than with a lower overall resolution. Growl really sets it off, among other things. However, it's only the flashy chrome crap that contributes nothing overall to the user interface that takes a hit. In general use, it's extremely responsive, as if it was running half the resolution. There were some thoughts floating around the intarweb about external video cards. The only thing I have seen on this front is the Tritton SEE2 USB to SVGA adapter which is not Apple compatible, and is in my opinion a vastly inferior solution. Perhaps if it ran on FireWire things would be different, but as it stands, this is the best solution imho.
There was also a question about running a setup like this with quad monitors. Yes, that should definitely work, using a dual output videocard, and using one dualHead2Go on head output. However, if the computer is at all upgradeable, I would strongly recommend simply using 2 dual head monitors, or four single head monitors, or some combination thereof. You'll spend much less money, and get better speed on 3d apps and whatnot.
Questions were also asked about compatibility with other Apple products. As near as I can tell, the dualHead2Go should be compatible with any mac, provided that it has at least 32MB of VRAM. This pretty much constitutes any modern system, from the iBook or Mini on up. The output is limited to either 2048x768 or 2560x1024, which means that whatever monitors you use should be natively able to display 1024x768 or 1280x1024, but other than that, there are no limitations.
5)
Actually, no. The dualHead2Go will automatically switch from split screen to mirror mode if the resolution is changed to 1280x1024. This means you just need to set the game or app to display at that resolution, and everything will be hunky dory, with the output mirroring on both monitors, instead of splitting across them.
6)
The background image is from 9xmedia.com. They have a small, but beautiful collection for dual screen and triple screen outputs. The translucent looking thing is the object inspector from the nightly build of Webkit, an infinitely useful tool comparable to Firefox's DOM inspector, only in my opinion more useful, even though it's only half complete.
The final thing people asked was about how to center the dock. The best thing I have found for this is the tinkertool. It will let you bind the dock across the bottom on the left or right side. This will keep it on one screen. I tried it that way for a couple days, but reverted to centered across the bottom and decided to simply make the dock larger to increase the readability. I have it hidden most of the time anyway, so it doesn't effect me too much.
I think that about does it. Any further question, just let me know.
Edit: A couple people have reported problems using the dualhead2go with different types of monitors. I'm looking further into the problem. Check the comments for more details.
After being dugg on our article about the dual head mac mini, there were several good questions pointed out on various sites. Most of these centered around things like DVI support, crap on my desk, software I am running, and the capabilities of the system under such a load. This post is aimed at answering those questions.
1) From zwitl at digg.com:
I dont understand these guys: they get the most limited and less upgradable of all macs (wich are known for ages to have a limited upgrade path, with various models with soldered cpus and complex to open cases). And yet, they go to extreme means to do things a slightly superior model can do out of the box. In this case, it's completely stupid: do dual display with only one VGA output and find an expensive way to split the signal over two screens, but then
- Since the OS thinks its driving one move monitor, every popup and windows appeir in the middle of both screens.
- Signal sync is hard to acheive and produce blur, a problem you can't have with DVI.
- Need a third party app to set the proper resolution.
- Add a lot of clutters on the desk, while having a iMac integrated into the screen driving a second monitor is a so easy and clean.
At the end, you lose the point of having a mini (small and simple) and get that ugly setup:
a white mac mini, a black microsoft mouse, two ugly grey 17" lcd, a black microsoft mouse and a beige keyboard.
Next: add an external videocard because the mini is unable to handle that resolution?
These are valid points. The reason we bought this particular mac, and not one that might have more upgradability is simple: 1st, Scott and I just went full time with Firefall Pro 5 months ago. As part of our startup cost, we had to purchase enough computer equipment for four full time employees, plus a server. We picked up the minis at $500 a piece, plus gigantor 22" CRT's for a combined cost of around $800 per computer. Throw in extraneous software and peripherals and the price came to a level $900. This is $400 less than the cheapest current iMac, which would have been a 17" monitor, and thus a drastic reduction in resolution.
Now no one is saying that we had the expectation of being able to upgrade the minis from the factory. At most, we intended to double the RAM, and maybe, just maybe, upgrade to a faster/larger HDD, be it through firewire or a replacement of the internal. And no one is saying that this particular solution to the dual screen output is completely ideal. But I will say this: it works, reliably and well. A cost comparison between this solution and using an iMac with two monitors comes out to $1170 vs. $1550, maintaining a significant margin.
With regard to the comment about the imac with a second monitor being "a so easy and clean," I personally feel that it is much less strain on the eyes to have two monitors which are exactly the same, vs. an Imac and a second totally disparate monitor, since Apple produces nothing in terms of standalone monitors that really matches it. And upgrading to an iMack also solves none of the lack of an upgrade path problem. To solve that, you need to move up to a G5 tower, which, as you may have guessed, costs a fair amount more.
2)
Wouldn't DVI provide a cleaner output by avoiding the blurryness caused by sync difficulties?
Indeed it would. However, there is nothing on the market which provides this type of split capability via DVI. perhaps in a year or two, there will be, and that will completely nullify this solution.
3)
Wow, your HCI is cluttered.
You could certainly say that, although I would say it's just right. I have two Westinghouse 17" LCD's, an Apple Extended ADB keyboard, a Microsoft optical mouse, a pair of headphones, and a mini. Also pictured is an ipod 5G. This set up was completely iterative. Originally it was simply a mini and a Phillips 22" CRT running at a breathtaking (and blinding) 1920x1440. We had also originally purchased sets of MS keyboards and mice, as they were cheap, and completely functional. The first swap was the ADB keyboard for the MS keyboard, since, as Scott said, I like "clicky" keyboards. They remind me of the Sun 386i I was weaned on. Then came the monitor upgrade. The reason I used Westinghouse as opposed to a prettier brand was because I had one sitting in a closet at home, and I like it when things match. the LCD quality on them is completely acceptable to me, as is the price / resolution, at $200 for 1280x1024. This of course, doesn't mean you couldn't use a more classical mac mix of hardware. This is what makes me happy.
4)
Your mini's back must be on the verge of breaking from all those pretty pixels.
Yeah, it does seem to groan more often set up like this than with a lower overall resolution. Growl really sets it off, among other things. However, it's only the flashy chrome crap that contributes nothing overall to the user interface that takes a hit. In general use, it's extremely responsive, as if it was running half the resolution. There were some thoughts floating around the intarweb about external video cards. The only thing I have seen on this front is the Tritton SEE2 USB to SVGA adapter which is not Apple compatible, and is in my opinion a vastly inferior solution. Perhaps if it ran on FireWire things would be different, but as it stands, this is the best solution imho.
There was also a question about running a setup like this with quad monitors. Yes, that should definitely work, using a dual output videocard, and using one dualHead2Go on head output. However, if the computer is at all upgradeable, I would strongly recommend simply using 2 dual head monitors, or four single head monitors, or some combination thereof. You'll spend much less money, and get better speed on 3d apps and whatnot.
Questions were also asked about compatibility with other Apple products. As near as I can tell, the dualHead2Go should be compatible with any mac, provided that it has at least 32MB of VRAM. This pretty much constitutes any modern system, from the iBook or Mini on up. The output is limited to either 2048x768 or 2560x1024, which means that whatever monitors you use should be natively able to display 1024x768 or 1280x1024, but other than that, there are no limitations.
5)
Isn't this unusable for any sort of fullscreen app?
Actually, no. The dualHead2Go will automatically switch from split screen to mirror mode if the resolution is changed to 1280x1024. This means you just need to set the game or app to display at that resolution, and everything will be hunky dory, with the output mirroring on both monitors, instead of splitting across them.
6)
Tell me about that wonderful thing you have on your monitor.
The background image is from 9xmedia.com. They have a small, but beautiful collection for dual screen and triple screen outputs. The translucent looking thing is the object inspector from the nightly build of Webkit, an infinitely useful tool comparable to Firefox's DOM inspector, only in my opinion more useful, even though it's only half complete.
The final thing people asked was about how to center the dock. The best thing I have found for this is the tinkertool. It will let you bind the dock across the bottom on the left or right side. This will keep it on one screen. I tried it that way for a couple days, but reverted to centered across the bottom and decided to simply make the dock larger to increase the readability. I have it hidden most of the time anyway, so it doesn't effect me too much.
I think that about does it. Any further question, just let me know.
Edit: A couple people have reported problems using the dualhead2go with different types of monitors. I'm looking further into the problem. Check the comments for more details.
posted by Aniel at
2:24 PM
17 Comments:
now you just need to:
1) Links to Free Apple !Minis!
2) figure out a way to get my dual display set up to work with one very large background spanning them without spanning the monitors.
3) if you keep getting hits on the voice blog figure out a way to make some money on it about 10 min of adwords action etcetra.
-Jomy
By
jomynOw, At
2/13/2006 10:30 PM
"1) Links to Free Apple !Minis!
I've heard of "conga" lines working sometimes, but I'd feel kinda sleazy pushing people through one. !olay!
"2) figure out a way to get my dual display set up to work with one very large background spanning them without spanning the monitors."
I'm not sure what you mean exactly. You could join two images together in Photoshop, then it would appear like you have two unique desktops when you really only have one. Aniel is currently using set of pictures that span both.
"3) if you keep getting hits on the voice blog figure out a way to make some money on it about 10 min of adwords action etcetra."
I was thinking about using AdWords, because we often talk about things you can buy, and surprisingly enough people don't know to ask Google. It kind of makes the site look a little more professional without them, but "everybody else is doing it, so why can't we?"
By
Scott, At
2/19/2006 1:36 PM
I am curious as I use Final Cut Pro 5 and After Effects 6.5, will this alow me to isolate just my Browser or my time line to a seperate monitor, from what it sounds like you can only split one image to two screens, but I want to be able to open up the browser all the way to see all of the details is this possible, or does it require a better video card? The next question is one of the monitors I have is a DVI can I put the adaptor on one of the connections and still run this monitor, and if so will it loose resolution? I need another monitor bably, I know that for this kind of workload a G5 is ideal but I just need to get by for a few months untill this current client pays for the work and then I can uprgade. I have already upgraded my mini to 1GB of ram and have the top of the line model 1.42GB processor, any suggestions on how to get this problem fixed would be greatly appriciated.
By
Anonymous, At
2/19/2006 6:44 PM
Hey anonymous, I'm not sure what the first part of your post is asking. I think you're asking whether you can stretch an app across both monitors and have parts of the app visible on one screen, and parts visible on the other. If this is your question, the answer is yes. Effectively, the computer thinks it has one ultra wide monitor, so anything you could do on one monitor, you can do on this. With regards to a DVI connection, you can set it up such that it goes mini->dualhead2go->dvi adapter->monitor 1, and dualhead2go->monitor 2. There won't be a problem with this, but remember that both monitors will display in exactly the same resolution, and that resolution can only be 1024x768 or 1280x1024.
I think you're right that you'd have much better luck for the things you're trying to do with a G5, as this kind of setup is going to absolutely pound your video card, but it will work nonetheless. Best of luck!
By
Aniel, At
2/20/2006 2:23 PM
Hi, and thanks for some interesting info. If I understand you correctly the OS will pop up messages in the center of the two screens. Have you found a way to work around this? Does it happen a lot?
Thanks, Brian.
By
Anonymous, At
3/05/2006 3:36 PM
Thanks so much for the information on making the dual monitors work for the mini. Just got it up and running last night.
Now I have dual monitors powered by my mini in an awesome video edtiting suite with a 20 inck NTSC monitor. It is very impressive when you see 3 monitors on an editing suite and you realize, WOW, all of that is powered by a mini.
By
Anonymous, At
4/23/2006 4:20 AM
I've just got the triplehead2go running successfully with a MacBook Pro. For details check here:
http://eskatonia.net/qcblog/2006/07/02/triplehead2go-running-on-macbook-pro/
By
Roger Bolton, At
7/01/2006 4:34 PM
ok, after stumbling onto your blog...i got so excited and i purchased the dualhead2go for our mac mini dual intel...i've just read (one of the postings) that you CAN'T get the dualhead2go with the intel macmini -darnit......ok, well i'm stubborn and determined... to at least try my hardest to get it to work...
HOWEVER...
I can't even get the files on the matrox software cd to install since they are all pc files...how did you even get these files to work on your mac? please help...any input will be greatly appreciated.
by the way, you might be interested in my specific use of this setup:
I manage a community tv studio and am outputting apple's keynote for our on-screen message board and hope to use the dualhead2go monitor to output another slideshow for other times through "Focus Enhancement's" TView.
This TView setup worked fine before when I was using our old g4 with dual monitor outs...but still trying to make the mac mini dual intel guy work for me... thanks again
By
tom Adams /TV Studio Manager, At
7/12/2006 3:58 PM
hallo,
i have the "dualhead 2go" for testing it with my mac mini. I attached two monitors with the dualhead 2go and my mac. the two monitors work, but they show the same picture and I can´t move the pointer between them.
Can you help me?
best regards
bexx
By
Anonymous, At
8/03/2006 7:48 AM
i've just read (one of the postings) that you CAN'T get the dualhead2go with the intel macmini -darnit......ok, well i'm stubborn and determined...
Tom Adams, if Roger Bolton can get his MacBook Pro working, then surely you can get the mini working...
I am currently looking at buying a beast of a mini (1.66GHz, 2G RAM, 120G HDD... the latest one), 2 19" Acer (on Amazon), and obviously, the dualhead2go... will I be able to plug'n'play?
cheers
By
Anonymous, At
8/09/2006 6:37 AM
I have an iBook G4... can I use dualhead2go?
By
Anonymous, At
8/09/2006 6:40 AM
The DualHead2Go works great with my Mac Mini Intel Core Duo!
By
Anonymous, At
8/24/2006 1:00 AM
Hi everyone, I bought the Matrox Dualhead2Go, but it is not working on dual core intel based mac mini with my 2 Acer 19" wide screens. All I get when I retstart is Unusable signal on the monitors. I am desperate to use both monitors, any ideas?
By
Anonymous, At
10/18/2006 4:09 PM
I have two Acer AL1912's, and also have the dual head2go. to get the "unusable signal" notice off go to system preferences under display and lower your refresh rate.
By
d i e m, At
11/15/2006 1:38 AM
A brief request:
Matrox's web site states that the Intel Mini Mac will only drive the dualhead at vertical resolutions of 768.
Can any Intel Mini users confirm or deny this with a quick post? I hope to buy a recent (Intel) Mini Mac for my wife and she will need a vertical res of 1024 pixels.
Many thanks;
-James
By
Anonymous, At
2/25/2007 6:35 AM
Try using ScreenRecycler.
That's the solution for the problem.
By
Anonymous, At
5/10/2007 3:08 AM
I'm thinking of buying a Mac Mini 2.0GHz (Intel Core 2 Duo) and would like to use two monitors as I used to with my old Quicksilver with its built in Twinview card. I see here that the Matrox DualHead2Go will allow me to do that, but when I checked with the distributor, I was told that the Intel GMA 950 GPU will not support a screen pixel depth of more than 768 pixels
As I have a nice 1280 x 1024 LCD screen, I would like to know if I have been properly advised, or is there some way around this?
By
TomG, At
4/16/2008 4:20 AM
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